In D29477#664697, @davidedmundson wrote:

See 399375. I don't like to rehash discussions.

I did and I didn't agree with the conclusion. I'll make a patch to Digikam too if necessary since apps, especially KDE apps, shouldn't use Meta.

What I wasn't aware of was that apparently @GB_2 already tried to make a patch here: D20730

I think it would be benefitial if we agree on this standard in T11520, the HIG or maybe XDG.

In D29477#664718, @GB_2 wrote:

I think it would be beneficial if we agree on this standard in T11520, the HIG or maybe XDG.

As far as I understood, we did: the Meta key is for window manager/global shortcuts, and we try our best to leave the ctrl and alt keys for apps--for exactly the reasons given here (avoiding conflicts with apps that typically use alt and ctrl).

In D29477#664697, @davidedmundson wrote:

See 399375. I don't like to rehash discussions.

The discussion didn't end with a useful resolution, though. The stance that all 2nd and 3rd-party apps are doing this wrong and people who want use those apps should be able to find this esoteric feature in KWin and change the shortcut themselves, is in my opinion unsatisfactory. It puts the burden onto someone else in a way that we can predict that they will not be willing or able to resolve, and meanwhile users remain frustrated. Good defaults matter.

As far as I can tell, there is no option not to break anybody; people using Krita, Inkscape, Blender, and others are *already* getting broken by this, while if we accept this patch, we break people who are currently using the Alt key for this. Because the status quo is already harmful to one group, we either need to come up with an innovative zero harm option, or compare harms.

If we do nothing (option 1), then users of the aforementioned apps will be broken and frustrated forever--the harm will continue indefinitely. But, if we accept this patch (option 2), we will harm existing users of the KWin feature by frustratingly changing the shortcut from under them. There is also an option 3: to change the default but migrate existing installations back to Alt so that nothing changes for current users. This could be a compromise between the competing harms, while also providing a path forward towards no harm in the future.

Regardless, I support some kind of path forward towards reducing or eliminating the harm. this patch does that and conforms with our own pseudo standard that window manager shortcuts should use the Meta key. If we want to make that an official KDE-wide or even an XDG thing first, then okay. What needs to happen for that?

XDG. KDE only is meaningless.

Make a spec, put it on their ML. Get it merged.

https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/xdg/2020-May/014298.html

In D29477#673039, @ndavis wrote:

Resuming this on invent

link ?

In D29477#673166, @meven wrote:

In D29477#673039, @ndavis wrote:

Resuming this on invent

link ?

https://invent.kde.org/plasma/kwin/-/merge_requests/12