𝒯𝒽𝑒 𝑔𝓇𝑒𝒶𝓉𝑒𝓈𝓉 𝒫𝓁𝒶𝓈𝓂𝒶 𝟧 𝓎𝑜𝓊'𝓁𝓁 𝑒𝓋𝑒𝓇 𝓈𝑒𝑒

I think this is a very valid goal, and I think it totally deserves to be voted. I'm willing to focus on this if it gets selected, so I'll step in to make sure it gets its chance. If Janet wants to come back to the community and lead this goal in the future I'll be happy to shift this to her anytime.

I mean

I doubt that's feasible; a better approach would be to actually investigate the shortcomings of Baloo and improve it as much as possible. Reddit experience is very anectodal, and some better profiling could be needed to pinpoint the issues.

The goal is interesting, but I think the plan is not adequate. File indexing, as an example, is not a feature that you can simply remove or disable by default. It is something that users rightfully expect out of their operating system.

As much as I agree with this goal, please use the goal template to expand on the goal description!

Hey! I think this goal could benefit from a bit more explanation. You can find the template one and copy the sections from there

Love the ideas here.

Ah, I think I have not upstreamed it yet; will do it for the 5.25 release.

I'm replicating the UIs of various plasma components in HTML/CSS, yes

Currently I'm working on bringing one video to life, with some 3d animations and stuff. My plan currently is:

Nayam, what did you use to make the demo clip 2?

In T14753#263346, @aronkvh wrote:

Another nice reference with smooth animations but no fancy physical 3d

Even Microsoft's live event for Windows 11 has been derided for being a borefest

1. What do we want to achieve?

Stuff we can do on a distro level:

Here's my take on this:

• I think the Koko information sidebar, when opened, should stay there as a sidebar rather than a overlay
• I think the "crop" tool is a bit behind the Gwenview's:
  • Crop area should be same size as the image by default, and should not be able to be bigger or outsite the image itself
  • You should be able to set a aspect ratio for cropping, potentially "keep the same ratio as original image"

That's great! @mikeljohnson, what do you think the next step for Koko is?

I think it's a good idea.

I think it's not appropriate to skip 23 and 24, that would confuse users too much. However, moving the release day makes sense to me.

Makes sense; so let's try to keep it barebone. I think that we at least need the activity tabs and the desktop grid functionality. It's fair to assume that switching windows in your desktop on the fly will be harder if you get a desktop grid as soon as you open this effect, which is why I had preferred for a 2-step effect where you can first see your desktop and then de-zoom to see all the other ones. A shortcut could also be made to trigger the grid directly, but switching between the two would still be possible (and easy, e.g. scrolling or arrows I guess) and we'd unify the two effects. I think it's a simple yet effective solution.

Seems correct to me

We've got a tie. Ideas?

Let's try to go with another round of voting, then. I'd say let's do as before, but with "new contest" being an option like other wallpapers.

Maybe we should do a new vote including the possibility of a new contest. I'm just not much convinced that Altai fits well in the kde plasma style; even more than Milky Way.

I think we might want to do a wallpaper contest for 5.22, to get a round of new wallpapers. We used most of the best ones collected in previous contests.

Shall we go for a new round of (-2, -1, +1, +2) voting for the next wallpaper?

In T13927#245978, @ngraham wrote:

What is "pop shell"?

In T13815#243933, @ngraham wrote:

My android phone has a hardware back button in the bottom-right corner of the device, below the screen. Almost every other Android phone I've ever seen has the same thing. Is that a thing that nobody does anymore?

In T13815#243929, @ngraham wrote:

On Android, isn't the global back button a hardware thing?

Link for today: https://meet.kde.org/b/nic-uuj-s1f

Today I tried creating a new document in the shared folder. Without even having any other person editing it, it was just me writing, the file cleared itself two times, loosing the content. I was expecting this and I had copied the content elsewhere, so it has not damaged me this time. But currently it seems like the shared folder is impossible to use reliably.

Is text under icons your personal setting? Will I see text alongside icons then?

+1 to a toolbar. My suggestion would be to have text alongside icons, as we rarely (=pretty much never) use text under icons and would thus be more consistent and free more vertical space. If the button's don't fit in the toolbar, some buttons could also work without their labels, such as copy and paste or s.lit viev, since their icons are extremely recognizable already. Also please consider using some separators and/or fill width spacers

Just for fun: FerenOSdev was the most harsh when giving votes (their personal sum is -6), while Carl was the kindest (with 6).
The Shell wallpaper author was contacted.

Unless I counted wrong, the results currently are:

Crystaline: +2
Grand Canyon: -1
Vera: +1
Beach: +1
Flow Dark: +2
Altai: -2
Milky Way: -1
Rainy morning: -2
Slant: +1
Kay: -2
Shell: +1

This was implemented in Kirigami and it's waiting for a QWidgets counterpart

What about: 5.20 darker flow, 5.21 milky way? That could be a good compromise

Even though I'm not a fan of Milky Way, I guess we should find compromises, so I'm ok with it being used in 5.19 if it's preferred over darker flow

I'd strongly strongly suggest doing a contest for plasma 6. It would result surely in a new beautiful wallpaper and it would help promotion greatly.

Magic convoluted solution, second try:

• The plasma themes defines four new margins: left-margin, center-margin, right-margin, separator-margin
• Specifying a generic margin will set the same margin to all three for backward compatibility of third party themes
• At startup and every time an applet is added or moved, the total number of applets with fillWidth: true (which we'll call "separators" here) is counted
  • All applets with fillWidth: true (the separators) get the separator-margin
  • All applets where separatorsLeftOfThisApplet / totalSeparators < 0.5 get the left-margin
  • All applets where separatorsLeftOfThisApplet / totalSeparators = 0.5 get the center-margin
  • All applets where separatorsLeftOfThisApplet / totalSeparators < 0.5 get the right-margin
  • (separatorsLeftOfThisApplet are the separators left of the applet in horizontal panels, and separators above the applet in vertical ones)
• A new enum costrainmenthints is added, a new property to appletinterface of the same name is added
• The task managers sets the costrainmenthints property to fillArea
• The task manager then sets taskmanager.svg normal-margin internally
• We make the panel 44 px with: 4px left-margin, 8px separator-margin, 8px center-margin, (or 4px?) 8px right-margin
• Make system tray adapt to panel size again, 2 rows where feasible
• We add 2 separators left and right of the tray
• We consider putting the concise date next to the time on horizontal panels (10:40 9 Jan)
• We consider using the vertical version of the clock in https://invent.kde.org/plasma/plasma-workspace/-/merge_requests/222

Implementation:
https://invent.kde.org/plasma/plasma-desktop/-/merge_requests/92
https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/plasma-framework/-/merge_requests/60
https://invent.kde.org/plasma/plasma-desktop/-/merge_requests/128
https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/plasma-framework/-/merge_requests/77
https://invent.kde.org/plasma/plasma-desktop/-/merge_requests/129

In T12839#236897, @clel wrote:

I'd vote for that, can you create a mockup?

In T12839#237957, @clel wrote:

This would be a nice addition. As I read it it introduces separate areas with separate margins. I wrote about a similar idea recently on a related GitLab issue. One thing to think about would be how many areas (two, three, more?) are sensible or whether one could easily change that in the future.

If we wanted to go with 32px TM icons by default, here's how it could be nicely and consistently handled:

In T12839#237953, @ngraham wrote:

22px TM/widget icons with a thin panel is fine, but the thicker the panel becomes, the sillier 22px icons look inside it. 22px icons in a 46px panel results in more spacing than icon. At this size, TM/widget icons really need to be 32px or else they just look lost inside their frame

I do have a touchscreen and the target is big enough to easily click. I think they do feel a bit small, but
a) It's not too small, and you can easily get used to it
b) it's weird that icons are this small. conventionally they should be 24px, but apparently iconSizes.smallMedium was decided to be 22px instead, and the svg contains an additional 2px margin meaning the actual icon is often 20px or even smaller. I think if all icons were 24px at least, the situation would be drastically better.

Actually, there's a third option I prefer. What about a smaller panel, so the icons are not felt "floating", but keeping 22px icons in the TM? See:

People really liked Flow Light. My suggestion is to switch to Flow Dark for 5.20.

We can make the plasma icon ignore margins.

I have two proposals:

1. a 44px panel with 22px widgets and 28px task manager

2. a 44px panel with 22px widgets and 32px task manager (which would be consistent with applets who extend to panel margins, such as the pager)

After some discussion with Nate and Noah, these points were agreed upon:

• upstream latte separator
• add separator button
• separator left and right of the tray
• all widgets use 22px icons by default
• 44px panel
• systray stays 22px regardless of the panel size
• option to make systray bigger as well

In T12839#236817, @ngraham wrote:

Seems like your proposed approach already satisfies 1-3. We'll need to do 5, and maybe discuss whether we should do 4 as well.

One concern I have visually is that the Task Manager icons appear very small inside their now-a-bit-larger frames. They look a bit lost in there IMO. Not a huge deal though, and maybe it's just something to get used to.

Also I wonder how we're going to handle smaller panels? 8px margins are going to be much too large for skinny panels that I know a lot of people like. We'll want to reduce that progressively as panel size drops, probably eventually winding up with 2px margins for really thin panels.

I think our goal is to provide a good balance of icon size consistency and panel aesthetic. The idea of making all icon of the same size is - I think - good, as long as those icons are not excessively big nor small, and I'm afraid that neither 32px nor 22px icon visually work on our default 46px panel when icons are all perfectly the same size. So we have to sacrifice a bit of consistency. With my idea (and, now, implementation) - that 100% looks like Manuel mockup - I think we get a good balance of both:

Regarding the technical implementation, I'd make Plasma able to selectively add margin or not for each widget separately; this way all widgets are supported. I wouldn't make the user able to toggle those in the UI yet, we could decide if it's appropriate to add that in the future based on user requests. Right now the plasmoid itself could decide whether to have margin (the default) or not. Task manager really *has* to ignore margin to extend to borders, but then the margins are added back through the task manager internal margins defined in the theme.

The task manager ignores margin but we can make it apply internal ones as big as the panel ones, so the icon sizes should still be consistent; Manuel was proposing to downscale 64px app icons to a 22px space, which - considering 32px icon sizes - would be as big as the actual launcher icon:

The Application Launcher applet icon is okay, it's just that it looks too small next to the task manager. Imagine having this small icon in Manuel's mockup:

It was also suggested to make this setting user-facing (by hovering the widget in panel edit mode); I wouldn't do that yet because this is something very technical that the average user shouldn't want to change sizes, plus it could result in inconsistent sizing in the icons that we'd instead like to be consistent (minimize all, tray, clock, etc). This doesn't mean that we couldn't add it in the future if it turns out to be more necessary than we thought.

+1

I don't know where to put this, so
I'd propose to keep the panel transparent but make the widget opaque. Here's how this would look with some different active applet designs:

strong +1